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Chung Dzi??
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Posted by: lopacki Post Reply
03/03/2014, 14:06:22

I bought this bead at least thirty years ago most likely thirty five. I have always assumed that it is truly authentic and old. Would love some feed back from all you forum members.

I did have it at Tucson and it generated plenty of interest, had one person come and look with magnification three times and am amazed I still own it.

Art looked at it and felt that it most likely is old. It has been poorly drilled from both ends.

All my best ....... Danny

P.S. There is a crack in the bead that can be seen in the first image at the upper left.

81_2.jpg (126.9 KB)  


Modified by lopacki at Mon, Mar 03, 2014, 14:09:14

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It is possible to have an original dZi without wear indicators/Hard to believe in this bead...
Re: Chung Dzi?? -- lopacki Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake Post Reply
03/03/2014, 14:21:41

www.nomadbeads.com

Modified by jake at Mon, Mar 03, 2014, 14:23:22

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Thanks Jake hope a few others chime in.
Re: It is possible to have an original dZi without wear indicators/Hard to believe in this bead... -- jake Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: lopacki Post Reply
03/03/2014, 15:43:38



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Re: Chung Dzi??
Re: Chung Dzi?? -- lopacki Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: bonpo Post Reply
03/04/2014, 14:19:40

very hard to tell from the small image, but it could be Ancient..some excavated dzis have no wear,and can look as if new.



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Fact: if this bead's been in Lopacki's collection for thirty years..it is an original ancient dZi...
Re: Re: Chung Dzi?? -- bonpo Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake Post Reply
03/04/2014, 22:37:41

www.nomadbeads.com

Modified by jake at Tue, Mar 04, 2014, 22:56:50

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Authenticated provenance create value and wear characteristics are also authentication<>.
Re: Fact: if this bead's been in Lopacki's collection for thirty years..it is an original ancient dZi... -- jake Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake Post Reply
03/04/2014, 22:53:52

www.nomadbeads.com

Modified by jake at Tue, Mar 04, 2014, 23:04:13

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Re: Fact: ...OOPS, NOT A FACT !...if this bead's been in Lopacki's collection
Re: Fact: if this bead's been in Lopacki's collection for thirty years..it is an original ancient dZi... -- jake Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: mosquitobay Post Reply
03/05/2014, 14:12:10

Hi Jake and all,

Sorry to disagree, but while the bead in question may very well be authentic (I don't choose to weigh in on that subject because it is not my field of expertise).

There have been fakes or replicas out there for much longer than 30 years. I have heard tales from some Tibetan friends of replicas being traded around as much as 100 years ago and maybe older.

Here is another pretty good fake:

Jan

Dzi-21a.jpg (24.4 KB)  


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Jan very good to see you again, hope you are sooooper! The BCN surely misses your posting.
Re: Re: Fact: ...OOPS, NOT A FACT !...if this bead's been in Lopacki's collection -- mosquitobay Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake Post Reply
03/05/2014, 22:00:55

In the murky mythy history of dZi, you may be right. :)

www.nomadbeads.com

Modified by jake at Wed, Mar 05, 2014, 22:08:18

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Re: Re: Fact: ...OOPS, NOT A FACT !...if this bead's been in Lopacki's collection
Re: Re: Fact: ...OOPS, NOT A FACT !...if this bead's been in Lopacki's collection -- mosquitobay Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: lopacki Post Reply
03/07/2014, 13:39:11

Thanks Jan for this information. From what you say your Tibetan friends have told you perhaps I have a vintage replica.It is still a cool bead.

In a private email Jamey told me that the Germans were making "dzi look" beads that far back. Your image looks like that is where this bead was most likely made.

All my best ...... Danny



Modified by lopacki at Fri, Mar 07, 2014, 13:41:53

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May not apply, but the German dZi I've seen were more polished, finely cut...
Re: Re: Re: Fact: ...OOPS, NOT A FACT !...if this bead's been in Lopacki's collection -- lopacki Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake Post Reply
03/07/2014, 14:08:46

www.nomadbeads.com

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Re: May not apply, but the German dZi I've seen were more polished, finely cut...
Re: May not apply, but the German dZi I've seen were more polished, finely cut... -- jake Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: lopacki Post Reply
03/08/2014, 08:23:43

Jake,
I thought about it after my last post and came to the conclusion that all of the German made dzi beads I have seen are just that and no Chung Dzi,this makes me again think that this bead may be what I have always thought it was. VERY VERY OLD

All my best ....... Danny



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How would you describe the perforation?
Re: Re: May not apply, but the German dZi I've seen were more polished, finely cut... -- lopacki Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake Post Reply
03/08/2014, 08:29:42

www.nomadbeads.com

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Started out Chung Dzi and changed to Dzi
Re: How would you describe the perforation? -- jake Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: lopacki Post Reply
03/11/2014, 14:17:11

Jake,
Seems funny this thread went from Chung Dzi to Dzi.

I had more than one person point out that the Germans made Dzi beads about 150 to 100 years ago, this is true as I found examples on the internet. The thing is that I have yet to find any German made Chung Dzi and the only reproductions of Chung Dzi seem to be those being made in China today and they are easy to identify as newly made, perhaps some were made in Taiwan (I know they made Dzi but donít know if they made Chung Dzi).

Again I will say I have had this bead for at least thirty years (my memory is still intact) so at this point I will have to assume this bead is in fact a true Chung Dzi until someone can prove otherwise.

You asked about the perforations on this bead. Using an eye loupe on one end the hole only goes in about one third of the way and is very off centered once it gets going. On the other end the hole starts out centered but quickly goes way off center.

I have added images for you to look at but they are lacking. Unless I sell this bead prior to Tucson next year I will have it at the show, then you can have a close up look in your hand.

All my best ..... Danny

P.S. I purchased this bead and a few others at the same time, one such bead is the Jia Chua we are discussing right now on another thread.

95_1.jpg (85.2 KB)  


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It does not resound German.
Re: Started out Chung Dzi and changed to Dzi -- lopacki Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake Post Reply
03/12/2014, 21:16:53

www.nomadbeads.com

Modified by jake at Wed, Mar 12, 2014, 21:18:01

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original or not
Re: Chung Dzi?? -- lopacki Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: bonpo Post Reply
03/05/2014, 00:51:33

this is the quality one must be really careful of.

mix this one with 10 other Authentic dzis, very dangerous.


321337943760

$_3_(26).jpg (44.1 KB)  $_3_(24).jpg (46.7 KB)  


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That's for sure...Exactly what happened in HK!!
Re: original or not -- bonpo Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake Post Reply
03/05/2014, 07:57:02

www.nomadbeads.com

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