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Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/20/2013, 11:37:38

my---bead----

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/20/2013, 11:39:34

I do not understand English! !

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Question for Liuyanchao, Tofsia & Jake:
Re: Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Frederick Post Reply
06/20/2013, 20:57:42

Would love to learn from your opinions; please provide clues for judgement of the chung dZi bead.

Frederick

Modified by Frederick at Fri, Jun 21, 2013, 02:53:11

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I will try Fred...
Re: Question for Liuyanchao, Tofsia & Jake: -- Frederick Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake@nomaddesign Post Reply
06/21/2013, 00:40:06

IMHO: One general fact, chung dZi were never worn as often as mik dZi, this usually makes chung dZi harder to Identify. The lesser impact of wear, lowers the amount of wear characteristics. When examining an uncirculated Venetian bead one must consider the empirical evidence of history, original glass colorants, styles, shapes, techniques, and tools etcetera of the original era. The situation is equivalent with Chung dZi. like myself many of the esteemed collectors, travelers, researchers, and dealers whom haunt this forum have been handling decorated agate before the Chinese were capable of reproducing dZi. I personally was obsessed, I quizzically conversed, studied, read, and re-read from every article, book, and dealer I could find. I also obsessively collected, bought sold and handled as many dZi as possible during this mostly uncontaminated era. This said, when I try and identify a chung dZi, I am pulling my opinion from this myriad of experience.


Sleep now, more later?...



Modified by jake@nomaddesign at Fri, Jun 21, 2013, 00:42:58

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gzi speak to me
Re: Question for Liuyanchao, Tofsia & Jake: -- Frederick Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: tofsla Post Reply
06/21/2013, 09:13:17

They talk to me - and saying back I AM FAKE FAKE FAKE...or I AM REAL REAL REAL... plus when it comes down to something that cost 20,000 i will never ever give it benefit of doubt. ITS $20,000



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Re: Question for Liuyanchao, Tofsia & Jake:
Re: Question for Liuyanchao, Tofsia & Jake: -- Frederick Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jj Post Reply
06/22/2013, 03:57:19

Hi Fred - the skin on the 2nd bead is a red light.. a little too regular in its patina, does not mean its definitely a copy, but raises a suspicion. Would need to check closer to be sure.



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What do people think of this bead?
Re: Question for Liuyanchao, Tofsia & Jake: -- Frederick Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake@nomaddesign Post Reply
06/22/2013, 17:07:41

This bead is posted for sale on the Garuda website, I do find it beautiful, and think it authentic. Probably asking something like $40,000? IDK. Scroll down and there is a curious, beautiful half four eye which I enquired about ($8000). I do have a beautiful match for it, though my half, as usual shows the honey under color at the broken section.

Garuda did recently sell the beautiful three eye shown in the banner for large sum, it is my understanding that the buyer is in Tibet. I do not know if the buyer is Chinese/Tibetan.

What do you think?

Garuda_Sago_Namgo.jpg (10.4 KB)  Garuda_Sago_Namgo_II.jpg (11.0 KB)  

Related link: Garuda dZi page
Modified by jake@nomaddesign at Sat, Jun 22, 2013, 18:05:11

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I think James (Garuda) will never lie
Re: What do people think of this bead? -- jake@nomaddesign Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: tofsla Post Reply
06/23/2013, 06:08:05

I personally think James is good man and Dharma practitioner and will never lie on the subject of the gzi beads.

If he saying its real - it is real. it also look real to me, so i will be confident buying from him any day and any time. its just question of price! and for many different reasons I refuse to comment on price!



Modified by tofsla at Sun, Jun 23, 2013, 07:49:45

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Ooopsies... I spit out a value for the Sago Namgo which is way to high...Close to half
Re: What do people think of this bead? -- jake@nomaddesign Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake@nomaddesign Post Reply
06/23/2013, 20:38:03



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Wa
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake@nomaddesign Post Reply
06/20/2013, 12:37:56

哇!很漂亮!I especially enjoy the carved human bone apron component.



Modified by jake@nomaddesign at Thu, Jun 20, 2013, 12:47:34

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yes! very well cooked gzi!
Re: Wa -- jake@nomaddesign Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: tofsla Post Reply
06/20/2013, 13:43:04



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need to check it but most likley its new made
Re: yes! very well cooked gzi! -- tofsla Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: tofsla Post Reply
06/20/2013, 14:11:58



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To clarify, I am referring to the chung dZi~The ends of the Mik dZi have been altered
Re: need to check it but most likley its new made -- tofsla Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake@nomaddesign Post Reply
06/20/2013, 14:37:50



Modified by jake@nomaddesign at Sun, Jun 23, 2013, 09:57:15

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i am almost 99% sure its not
Re: To clarify, I am referring to the chung dZi~The ends of the Mik dZi have been altered -- jake@nomaddesign Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: tofsla Post Reply
06/20/2013, 16:46:52

cooked



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got it. i was talking about gzi!
Re: To clarify, I am referring to the chung dZi~The ends of the Mik dZi have been altered -- jake@nomaddesign Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: tofsla Post Reply
06/23/2013, 06:09:25

i can't tell chungdzi without examine it.



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Ni Hao welcome to the forum!!
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: lopacki Post Reply
06/20/2013, 13:22:32



Modified by lopacki at Thu, Jun 20, 2013, 13:23:15

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:11:04

I have no good way to distinguish dzi beads! Only to see more, and see more pictures is a good way (after all, we can not find a lot to see in the hand),

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:11:58

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:13:48

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:14:07

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:14:19

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:15:37

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:24:30

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:24:59

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Re: Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: TASART Post Reply
08/29/2013, 17:36:47

2



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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:25:15

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:25:36

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:25:58

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:26:39

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:26:56

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:27:13

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 03:27:41

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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 15:42:51

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Re: Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuxiao Post Reply
07/12/2013, 09:05:04

Ư˫۰



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Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: liuyanchao Post Reply
06/21/2013, 15:46:05

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On the other hand, Liuyanchao, Tofsia & Jake~
Re: zhangyang2305@live.cn -- liuyanchao Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Frederick Post Reply
06/22/2013, 00:10:47

Perhaps there are clues which would help a novice -such as myself- identify a fake. Would any of you kindly suggest what to look for when we are suspicious of a $20,000.00 dZi bead?

I realize that it is extremely difficult to explain what makes something "right." However, it seems comparatively easy to point out the characteristics of a copy. Your expertise is highly appreciated.

Thank you,

Frederick

Modified by Frederick at Sat, Jun 22, 2013, 00:57:53

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Hi Fred~
Re: On the other hand, Liuyanchao, Tofsia & Jake~ -- Frederick Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake@nomaddesign Post Reply
06/22/2013, 13:48:09

The most valuable dZi from my collection is a beautiful chocolate Sago Namgo, it is the closest I could come toward this outlandish value. When I look at this bead there is no doubt in my mind of it's authenticity, of course it does not hurt that I acquired it before the surge of reproductions. The patinated color, the beautifully polished perforation, the perfect conchoidal percussion fractures. I love the bead, and it is not a question of price, of course I have not acquired any extremely valuable dZi in many years. will try and post a photo from my phone.



Modified by jake@nomaddesign at Sat, Jun 22, 2013, 17:32:20

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Posting 2 images for Jake...
Re: Hi Fred~ -- jake@nomaddesign Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Joyce Post Reply
06/23/2013, 07:21:33

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Chocolate Sago Namgo, and a beautiful two eye Mik dZi I gave to my father/Thanks Joyce!
Re: Posting 2 images for Jake... -- Joyce Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake@nomaddesign Post Reply
06/23/2013, 08:17:46

Fred~ I have not been handling many original dZi outside of my collection for some time and I am sure that I have quite a lot to learn. Lately I have been buying some of the good fake antique dZi to understand the differences between the true historical beads, and the ones with false age. Actually in your hand most of them are very discernible, though I cannot afford the very good fakes.



Modified by jake@nomaddesign at Sun, Jun 23, 2013, 11:09:31

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As real as it gets
Re: Chocolate Sago Namgo, and a beautiful two eye Mik dZi I gave to my father/Thanks Joyce! -- jake@nomaddesign Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: tofsla Post Reply
06/26/2013, 17:09:42

Jake - no question is real gzi and provide for wearer all benefits that only real gzi give. My personal view is - that gzi is gzi is gzi.. as soon as its real - you will get everything you expecting from wearing it (i been wearing gzi beads for 20+ years).

Considering where prices are now, I think you very fortunate man to have them in your collection. I can say same about myself - i could never buy what i have now at current prices. I still remember somone coming to my hotel in Peshawar for 2 days trying to convince me to buy some 4eye gzi bead back in late 80ties and me refusing do so... I wish I knew, I wish he knew :)

On subject of pricing and grading. There are A B C D grade of pure gzi beads (same as diamonds) , and prices we often hear about are applicable to grade A beads. Most pieces you see for sale on internet or by American/European dealers are mostly grade C with very few of grade B... You 2 eyes are typical grade B bead and sago-namgo grade C bead, 3eyes you been talking about from Garuda website is C-- (almost D) and sago-namgo from same website is C. I think its very important consideration when people price/buy gzi beads. Not all gzi are priced same, while all gzi beads provide same benefits for wearer!

Hope my mumble helps

P.S. On another note - i think its just matter of price. If somone prepare to pay market price - there are very few beads that you can't buy. name what you want - and i can source it! so when everything said and done - its all about money, i.e rather boring subject!



Modified by tofsla at Wed, Jun 26, 2013, 17:19:47

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