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Mystery carved nut beads - Chinese?
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Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
02/07/2013, 11:58:01

Found an old watch chain with 16 matching carved beads. The fob ornament is a pressed glass intaglio of the Roman goddess Ceres, in a deep rust color, apparently meant to imitate carnelian. The intaglio bezel seems to be brass, although the chain and toggle look more like gold-filled. The trademark on the clasp is G.&Co., which may or may not be a manufacturer of this sort of item around the time of WWI. According to info on the internet, pocket watches went out of fashion after WWI and wrist watches became the thing for gentlemen to wear.

http://www.silvermakersmarks.co.uk/Makers/Birmingham-G.html

The pattern on the beads is a trailing vine with two oppositely positioned flowers, which I suppose could be lotus but which resemble chrysanthemums more to my eye. They show wear from the chain, and one has an old chip. They measure about 15x11mm.

So - question number one is, are these actually Chinese-made carved nut beads? Or something else?

Question number two is, should I take it apart to use the beads, or would this totally destroy any provenance that might be attached to such beads?

There seem to be many old Chinese beads featuring lohan and rounded lotus leaves, but these don't seem to fit into that category.

CarvedNutWatchChain_001.JPG (52.5 KB)  CarvedNutWatchChain_002.JPG (67.9 KB)  


Modified by beadiste at Thu, Feb 07, 2013, 12:00:19

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Re: Mystery carved nut beads - Chinese?
Re: Mystery carved nut beads - Chinese? -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: highlander Post Reply
02/07/2013, 12:46:51

Here's a link using our search funtion that you'll want to go over, from what you've learned & then posted here & after looking at the pic, my experience lends a mere guess that they appear to be Chinese carved nuts (walnut) & typical of offerings from 1850's - 1940's.

There may be no economical way to date an individual nut, so that the provenance may lie in the other items/materials that make up the entire 'chain.' Removing any damaged beads (if there are any) may not hurt the overall value and yet may even give it more value, that is - an appraisser/buyer will make their decision on the final value.

No action is inherently right or wrong, if you take it apart for the indivdual beads, then you do, repurposing antique/vintage beads is a global passion.

Its an impressive item that I wouldn't disassemble, that's simply my two opinions. As for rarity, the carved nuts aren't hard to find here in the U.S., having them done in original state such as your's is are probably few and far between, best you can do is to ever venture to ever see another, some of us here will also keep a keen eye out now too! I'll check my files soon for anything identical/similar.



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Criminy, my mind is going
Re: Mystery carved nut beads - Chinese? -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
02/07/2013, 13:05:37

Thanks, Nick, for the reminder to search the archives here.

Believe it or not, a few weeks ago I posted a link to an eBay auction featuring what appears to be beads damned near identical to the ones I have on the watch chain, right down to the flowers and leaves on the vine motif. No wonder I thought they looked Chinese.

eBay 110984592465.

Guess I need to stop banging my head on my desk so often, brain damage has occurred.

ChineseCarvedNutBeads.JPG (53.4 KB)  ChineseCarvedNutBeadsA.JPG (46.1 KB)  

Related link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/LOVELY-ANTIQUE-CHINESE-HAND-CARVED-NUT-WOOD-BEAD-NECKLACE-c1800s-NO-RESERVE-/110984592465
Modified by beadiste at Thu, Feb 07, 2013, 13:15:51

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Re: Mystery carved nut beads - Chinese?
Re: Mystery carved nut beads - Chinese? -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Stefany Post Reply
02/07/2013, 13:28:01

yes chinese, most likely also 3-lobed canarium nut. i dont think they belong with the pendant, and maybe neither with the chain.
being purely decorative its likely they are not the oldest pattern of these carved nuts and may have been just as novelties in mid 20th century, not for prayer or denoting rank but for tourists or export???



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It is an odd combination, isn't it
Re: Re: Mystery carved nut beads - Chinese? -- Stefany Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
02/07/2013, 13:48:15

But the beads were certainly strung when the watch chain was assembled, as all links are soldered and there's no way to get the beads off without cutting the chain.



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Canarium nuts
Re: Re: Mystery carved nut beads - Chinese? -- Stefany Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
02/07/2013, 13:52:39

Thanks, Stefany, I was puzzled as to what the nuts could be, as they just don't look like fruit pits.

The link has a neat photo, and says one of the common names is "Chinese black olive."

Photo also explains why the beads are hollow naturally, without manual carving.

CanariumNut.jpg (22.2 KB)  

Related link: http://www.ars.usda.gov/main/docs.htm?docid=18505
Modified by beadiste at Thu, Feb 07, 2013, 13:54:11

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Nice walnuts
Re: Mystery carved nut beads - Chinese? -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: will Post Reply
02/07/2013, 18:06:30

walnuts26a.jpg (57.3 KB)  walnuts26b.jpg (67.2 KB)  


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Contemporary Chinese nut carver's eBay page
Re: Mystery carved nut beads - Chinese? -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
02/07/2013, 22:06:24

Neat-o.

Show his small work table and tools.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Olive-nut-carving-olive-stone-carving-Rabbit-elaborate-12-Chinese-zodiac-signs-/221121035735


Related link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Olive-nut-carving-olive-stone-carving-Rabbit-elaborate-12-Chinese-zodiac-signs-/221121035735

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