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Simply smashing beads - jadeite, nephrite, etc.
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Posted by: Rosanna

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09/09/2014, 18:34:12

A little project that I did recently involved finding some dark "spinach green" jade beads for a project. When I ran out of the British Columbia nephrite beads that I had purchased over 10 years ago, I bought some additional dark green "jade" stone beads of unknown composition from a bead society member, and then purchased an entire strand of beads for $8 at a local bead show. The latter were designated British Columbia jade and were at a table piled high with extremely inexpensive strands.

Once I got the beads home, it was clear that the three groups of beads were different in color, although only slightly. Since I had enough to play with, I decided to smash one bead from each set to see what happened, and to see if the qualitative properties were different using this crude impact test. Jades are supposed to be very tough minerals. (Note: this was one of those times I actually missed still having my technical job since I tested materials for a living and could have done this in the lab with great precision. But no, I'm not going back!)

Anyway, here are the images of the beads and the results.

The original B.C. nephrite, which was sold by a vendor that had nothing but this material at the show and as I recall it was rather pricey. I believe it was correctly identified, since it was extremely difficult to smash with my sledge hammer. It took several blows to break the bead, and the fracture surfaces are whitish. This was a very tough material.

The darkest green beads from the bead society member took less muscle to break, and the bead shattered into many small shards. My Gemstones of the World book describes jadeite fracture as "splintery, brittle" so my tentative ID for this material is jadeite.

The $8 strand from the bead show had the lightest color green, and I fully expected them to show some sort of dyed surface and white core, as I suspected dyed howlite. The beads were quite easy to break, but as you can see the color goes right through. I don't know what this stone could be - any ideas? Certainly they were not B.C. nephrite. And, I think I read somewhere that the Chinese are calling any reasonably dark green stone "B.C. jade", which of course is very confusing and I'm sure deliberately so.

So there's the latest from sunny dry California - smashing beads on the cement floor of the garage in an attempt to match materials. But, I'm fully expecting that some forum members like Danny have done similar experiments and may have some comments.

Interesting
Re: Simply smashing beads - jadeite, nephrite, etc. -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: floorkasp

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09/10/2014, 02:57:05

I have broken my share of beads to see what I was dealing with. Great set of information here.
Have you tried scratching it? That could also give you and indication. The 8 dollar strand bead could be some type of soapstone? Most soapstone (though not all) scratches quite easily. I am sure there are
others on BCN who would know more about different types of stone.
I sure miss Russ.....

I have some dark green beads, with some type of carving on them. (similar to the ones in the link, but then dark green. They scratch easily, and I always thought they were some type of soapstone.

Anyway, your jade beads gave me an excuse to dig these pictures up again. Jade or jade-ish stones and bangles at the Panjiayuan in Beijing.

Related link: Carved beads

Re: Simply smashing beads - jadeite, nephrite, etc.
Re: Simply smashing beads - jadeite, nephrite, etc. -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: lopacki

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09/10/2014, 08:56:10

Rosanna,
Most likely the softer beads are made from either Serpentine or Bowenite.

The bead that smashed into small pieces I would say is Serpentine. If you do a scratch test with a steel scribe I would guess it will scratch easily.

For some reason the Chinese call all green stone Jade and then have other words for actual Jadeite.

All my best ........ Danny

Pin scratch test
Re: Re: Simply smashing beads - jadeite, nephrite, etc. -- lopacki	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: Rosanna

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09/10/2014, 15:29:57

Thanks Danny & Floor - I scratched all three beads with a common pin (the kind used for sewing) and all three seemed to scratch the same. I could see scratch marks easily using my 10X microscope. Very hard to say if the $8 bead scratched more easily than the other two.

Modified by Rosanna at Wed, Sep 10, 2014, 15:35:56

If they scratched none are Nephrite or Jadeite.
Re: Pin scratch test -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: lopacki

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09/10/2014, 17:02:14

Wow that is disappointing - wonder what the BC nephrite really is then
Re: If they scratched none are Nephrite or Jadeite. -- lopacki	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: Rosanna

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09/10/2014, 19:03:20

It really was incredibly hard to smash compared to the other two.

If I remember I'll bring them to Tucson next year and get your expert analysis in person.

Nephrite can be scratched if its composition is...
Re: Wow that is disappointing - wonder what the BC nephrite really is then -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: beadiste

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09/11/2014, 07:42:24

toward the tremolite end of the actinolite-tremolite series.

Cassiar Jade
Re: Wow that is disappointing - wonder what the BC nephrite really is then -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: beadiste

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09/11/2014, 18:53:53

Had some exceptional Canadian jade (nephrite) years ago, also some presumably-some-sort-of-serpentine beads that they referred to as "Flower Jade."
"Flower," as I believe Russ once explained, is a Chinese stone vendor catch-all term for "something-that-resembles-X-stone-but-isn't-it".

If anyone cares, let me know and I'll rummage through my storage boxes and take some pics.

yes please. I might even get more confused, but it is the only way to learn.
Re: Cassiar Jade -- beadiste	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: karavanserai

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09/12/2014, 03:18:44

martine

Polar Jade, actually
Re: Cassiar Jade -- beadiste	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: beadiste

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09/12/2014, 14:39:59

The company I bought these from is the Polar Jade company.

The Cassiar Mountains being the kind of place they are, the white splashes in the "flower jade" beads could be some form of asbestos.

Note the granular texture in the one "flower jade" bead that has a dink.

The second picture compares the "flower jade" with good quality 15mm nephrite beads.

Modified by beadiste at Fri, Sep 12, 2014, 14:40:17

Polar Jade - fine, good, and "flower" jade
Re: Polar Jade, actually -- beadiste	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: beadiste

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09/12/2014, 14:43:19

The 10mm beads and 15mm beads are about the same price, the 10mm beads being comparatively higher priced for their size because they are more translucent, mostly lack black spots. As I recall, the 15mm beads in this quality were a couple of grand. I settled for the good quality (darker, not as translucent, only a few black spots) in the 15mm size.

Modified by beadiste at Fri, Sep 12, 2014, 14:45:58

Black spots
Re: Polar Jade - fine, good, and "flower" jade -- beadiste	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: Rosanna

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09/12/2014, 17:10:36

My "B.C. nephrite" has black spots - does that mean it really is nephrite? Along with the beads, I bought a carved pendant. In bright light it appears lighter green, with black inclusions showing up.

black spots are characteristic of nephrite
Re: Black spots -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: beadiste

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09/12/2014, 18:06:32

which makes the relatively spot-free material more rare and expensive

Specific gravity liquid
Re: Simply smashing beads - jadeite, nephrite, etc. -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: beadiste

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09/10/2014, 11:44:26

The old jewelers of my acquaintance used a 3.0 specific gravity liquid to distinguish jade and nephrite from serpentines such as "Suchow jade" (which is what your third sample looks like to me).

http://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-1-4684-6572-3_3#page-1

a better link to the Desautels information
Re: Specific gravity liquid -- beadiste	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: beadiste

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09/10/2014, 20:23:27

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CDYQFjAD&url=http%3A%2F%2Flink.springer.com%2Fcontent%2Fpdf%2F10.1007%252F978-1-4684-6572-3_3.pdf&ei=oRQRVMahNsqhigLqrYDgDQ&usg=AFQjCNEG614ItLAmD5bkQQcVU_-g82XZ8A&sig2=Aaw95DnLKk27BPzy6BVk0w

This one allows you to read more than just the abstract. Concerns hardness, specific gravity, and refractive index.

Close-up pictures of the three different beads
Re: Simply smashing beads - jadeite, nephrite, etc. -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: Rosanna

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09/10/2014, 15:31:57

Hans asked for better detail on these so here are some additional photos. First set is the British Columbia nephrite. Note the fibrous structure.

Close-ups of the bead society member purchase
Re: Close-up pictures of the three different beads -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: Rosanna

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09/10/2014, 15:33:01

Serpentine
Re: Close-ups of the bead society member purchase -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: lopacki

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09/10/2014, 17:03:58

Close-ups of the $8 beads
Re: Close-up pictures of the three different beads -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: Rosanna

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09/10/2014, 15:33:58

Serpentine
Re: Close-ups of the $8 beads -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: lopacki

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09/10/2014, 17:04:26

Notice the crisp and unabraded #1 sample bead holes
Re: Close-up pictures of the three different beads -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: beadiste

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09/10/2014, 20:34:47

To me that looks like they are less new, have more wear but...
Re: Notice the crisp and unabraded #1 sample bead holes -- beadiste	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: karavanserai

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09/12/2014, 03:17:52

is this also a clue to stone hardness or any other characteristic of British Colombia nephrite?

martine

Re: Close-up pictures of the three different beads
Re: Close-up pictures of the three different beads -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: hans0621

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09/11/2014, 00:54:48

thank you Rosanne,
with your permission I will place your pictures with the comments of Lopacki in my Flickr album "The Boulevard of Broken Beads" to share.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/hans0621/sets/72157642734995904/

But maybe I have to change the phrase "No bead is harmed on purpose" in the intro" now. :-)

Thank you Hans what an interesting album!
Re: Re: Close-up pictures of the three different beads -- hans0621	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: karavanserai

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09/11/2014, 02:15:22

I have a broken 7 layer chevron somewhere. I'll be happy to send you some pictures.

martine

You're welcome Martine
Re: Thank you Hans what an interesting album! -- karavanserai	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: hans0621

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09/11/2014, 02:40:46

and pictures too :-)
maybe better to send them to Mail author, hans

Wow indeed interesting; Thank you Rosanna. About jadeite....
Re: Simply smashing beads - jadeite, nephrite, etc. -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: karavanserai

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09/11/2014, 02:13:56

is it possible to list the characteristics necessary to ID a bead as jadeite.On its whole and smashed.
Anyone please?
I love the colour but never dared to venture into the jadeite world. I know there is a lot of fraude or lack of knowledge amongst sellers as well. So please help me venture into this new material.

martine

The one page summary
Re: Wow indeed interesting; Thank you Rosanna. About jadeite.... -- karavanserai	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: beadiste

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09/11/2014, 07:30:40

http://www.gemologyonline.com/jadeite.html [and don't miss the link to Fred Ward's Friends of Jade, scrolling thru the messages to the California Jade meet-up]

The info from Paul Desautels' book cited in a prior link discusses the "easy" tests for jadeite and nephrite - hardness, specific gravity, and refractive index.

Dyed calcite, "Suzhou jade" (Bowenite serpentine), aventurine quartz, dyed quartz, serpentine, soapstone...just off the top of my head, these are the most common simulants. Not counting glass and plastic, of course.

Then there's jadeite that's been treated with acid to remove iron stains and filled with dyed polymer. You need an infrared spectrometer to detect this one, and it seems to be very common now.

In short, before you spend serious bucks on jadeite, get a professional gemmological report.

Related link: http://www.gemologyonline.com/jadeite.html
Modified by beadiste at Thu, Sep 11, 2014, 07:33:15

Re: The one page summary
Re: The one page summary -- beadiste	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: karavanserai

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09/11/2014, 09:51:01

Thank you! Lesson learned. I'll buy the ones I like that do not cost half my arm or just focus on all the other beads.

martine

Fred Ward's Jade book
Re: Simply smashing beads - jadeite, nephrite, etc. -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: beadiste

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09/12/2014, 18:10:26

A fave of mine, now in a revised edition -

http://www.amazon.com/Jade-Fred-Ward-Gem-Book/dp/1887651063

Related link: http://www.amazon.com/Jade-Fred-Ward-Gem-Book/dp/1887651063

Just received my copy today - excellent place to start if you're new to jade
Re: Fred Ward's Jade book -- beadiste	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: beadiste

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09/18/2014, 17:02:41

An eBay auction for the Desautels book
Re: Simply smashing beads - jadeite, nephrite, etc. -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: beadiste

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09/13/2014, 12:58:38

161123103028

Re: Simply smashing beads - jadeite, nephrite, etc.
Re: Simply smashing beads - jadeite, nephrite, etc. -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: mystically

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09/17/2014, 12:44:51

Hello, thanks for this interesting conversation. I worked quiet a few times with B.C. Jade and the two pictures attached is what is still left. The first bead is about two inches and has the typical black spots. The second pendant with carving work is without spots and about 90 grams. I leave it up to you guys to decide on quality..

Just to share .. All the best Sandro

Very nice- thank you!
Re: Re: Simply smashing beads - jadeite, nephrite, etc. -- mystically	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: Rosanna

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09/17/2014, 19:12:46

Meanwhile, in Jadeite World
Re: Simply smashing beads - jadeite, nephrite, etc. -- Rosanna	Post Reply	Edit		Forum	Where am I?

Posted by: beadiste

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09/17/2014, 17:29:07

http://www.gia.edu/gia-news-research-zhaoyi-jade-house-hsu

Don't miss the gallery slide show.

OK, so there are no beads... pretty sweet rings, tho, so those in the if-it-has-a-hole-it's-a-bead crew can chime in.

Modified by beadiste at Wed, Sep 17, 2014, 17:29:24

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