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I am delighted to have my first ancient zoomorphic bead!
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Posted by: jake Post Reply
03/14/2014, 01:36:11

I recently purchased this beautiful ancient from a BCN contributor. While I was compelled to acquire it truth be known I know precious little about it's origin. I did seek corroboration to which I was happily informed that it may be Tircul or potentially could even be as early as Mesopotamian? I still really don't know much. I just love the little talisman, and hope others may comment, inform, or even have a reference.

Something like 20mm long

Thank you.

1_lion_1_edited-2.jpg (125.7 KB)  
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There is something nice about it. And I would love to work with it too. Congratulations.
Re: I am delighted to have my first ancient zoomorphic bead! -- jake Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Frederick Post Reply
03/14/2014, 02:00:13

Frederick

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From limited observation..
Re: I am delighted to have my first ancient zoomorphic bead! -- jake Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: mosquitobay Post Reply
03/14/2014, 09:48:06

Hi Jake, It is a lovely piece, nice patina and condition. It is hard to believe the seller did not know some background on it though, at least from which region it came from.

By comparison to the figural items in my collection, which are mostly western Asia, it compares to some degree, but the only similar pieces I have (meaning kneeling cats) are drilled vertically for suspension rather than horizontally. On the other hand the Tircul or Samon Valley pieces I have are all drilled horizontal. Not sure if that is a significant indicator or not.

The type of animal appears to be a cat, at least somewhat similar to the type commonly seen in the Tircul groups. Maybe Will may get a chance to chime in.

Jan

See Tircul animals below:

bf319.jpg (64.4 KB)  


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Re: From limited observation..Jan I am SO glad that you are posting again lately!!!
Re: From limited observation.. -- mosquitobay Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake Post Reply
03/14/2014, 10:27:55

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The other lion
Re: I am delighted to have my first ancient zoomorphic bead! -- jake Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: will Post Reply
03/14/2014, 12:17:27

Hi there, Jake, Jan and Frederick,

Actually, Alison, who sold Jake and me these two beads, originally posted them here on the forum in January and was brushed off with a standard comment about the fakes which are made in Southeast Asia. I didn't see that brief exchange at the time, but saw the beads when Alison put them up for sale on eBay. The images were rather hard to make out, but Jake and I corresponded with each other about them and decided they certainly seemed to be authentic - which I'm sure now they are. I think Jake ended up with the better of the two (well done, Jake!), but they're both very nice.

But authentic what? Alison had bought them in London and been told they were Pyu, but I'm a bit doubtful about that. Both beads look to me to be intended to be lions, rather than the more common tigers which are generally portrayed as being more lithe and less bulky. It's generally supposed nowadays that the range of the Indian lion never extended into Southeast Asia, but I'm really not sure that that assumption is correct. If it is, then a lion-shaped bead would have had to be imported from India or, at the very least, copied from an Indian model. In fact, carnelian lions have been found both in Thailand (at Ban Don Tha Phet and Khao Sam Kaeo) and in Samon Valley and Tircul sites in Burma. Sometimes, with the Burmese examples, it's difficult to tell the tigers from the lions; last year I finally managed to get a friend to sell me a huge (nearly 10 cm) carnelian bead that I had been coveting for fifteen years or more; he said it was a tiger; I say it's a lion. I'll try to get a vaguely in-focus image of it and post it here sometime soon. I'll also attach here an image of a lion from a gold four-sided seal that was found at Khao Sam Kaeo, the ancient port and bead-making site on the southern Thai peninsula. It's rather similar to these crystal lions, though still not the same. The epigraphy dates it to the 4th century CE, and my own guess is that it was probably made at one of the Tircul cities in Burma.

Now, back to the two crystal lions. The reason I'm doubtful about them being Burmese is that all the ancient big cat beads that I've seen from there or from elsewhere in SE Asia are either standing or crouching. I don't think I've come across a well-provenanced sitting one. That's not to say there couldn't be a variant, but somehow the carving doesn't seem Samon Valley or Tircul to me, and the style seems slightly wrong too - almost all the early Burmese beads that I know are highly symmetrical, and in mine at least (what about yours, Jake?) the head is turned to one side, and the base is off-centre also.

Where else could they be from? Well, I've seen similarly-carved but not similarly-shaped crystal beads from Gandhara sites, and the lion is certainly associated with Gandharan Buddhism. That's a possibility. And in central Asia and west Asia there are a lot of lion beads and seals. I've seen a similar sitting image of one in a report of Bactrian excavations from Central Asia and my hunch is that that is probably where these two bead might prove to have come from. It would be great if somebody here could come up with a similar example.

All the best,

Will

SEAP334as.jpg (163.9 KB)  KhaoSamKaeo-seal.jpg (38.8 KB)  


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Excellent details as always Will..
Re: The other lion -- will Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: mosquitobay Post Reply
03/14/2014, 13:17:41

Very descriptive details.

I took another look at my western Asia figures and in fact there are not many that you could confirm as being lions or tigers, or bears for that matter. See pictures below of a group of four possibles. I guess that I have more frogs & birds than anything else.

The second pic is definitely a lioness (or possibly a tiger?). It is some type of finial piece and still has a bronze rod running through the recessed end piece. It is about 4 inches in length and very finely carved.

Any way, nice acquisition Jake.

bf320.jpg (65.8 KB)  bf321.jpg (39.5 KB)  


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Thank you so much for taking the time Will!!! Ooooh I do hope you will post the huge carnelian!
Re: The other lion -- will Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake Post Reply
03/15/2014, 15:22:24

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A bit of humor...maybe.
Re: I am delighted to have my first ancient zoomorphic bead! -- jake Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
03/14/2014, 13:16:18

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2013/08/130816-china-zoo-tibetan-mastiff-dog-lion-fraud-animals/

Although I confess to being dismayed by the conditions of the animal's confinement.



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I've an similar example
Re: I am delighted to have my first ancient zoomorphic bead! -- jake Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: sandrowjw Post Reply
03/16/2014, 23:01:14

Unfortunately I've no access to my photo album these days and I'll try post them later. The head of my piece is assymetrical as well.
I was not aware that this kind of crystal animal figure were so wide spreading and the only similar piece I saw previously was an elegantly cut lion from a Maurya period buddha tower. Thanks for the information!



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Here it is...
Re: I've an similar example -- sandrowjw Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: sandrowjw Post Reply
03/18/2014, 08:30:38

IMG_6999.jpg (44.4 KB)  


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different view
Re: Here it is... -- sandrowjw Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: sandrowjw Post Reply
03/18/2014, 08:32:13

IMG_7001.jpg (40.2 KB)  


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Ooooo that's cool.
Re: different view -- sandrowjw Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: jake Post Reply
03/18/2014, 08:43:36

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