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Pompeii Beads, Amulets and Ornaments Excavated
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Posted by: AnneLFG Post Reply
08/13/2019, 13:13:19

Excavated Pompeii wooden box yields Faience beads, Lamp wound glass beads, Stone beads, amulets, gems and personal ornaments.

IMGUR Album- Scroll down to see all Pics: https://imgur.com/a/FvAPKSh

Article: http://pompeiisites.org/en/press-releases/the-luck-and-the-protection-against-the-bad-fate-in-the-jewelery-of-regio-v/

Bead lover, collector since Age 15, semi-retired had wholesale/retail bead, folk art, tribal art store Lost and Found Gallery for 25 yrs. in DT Greensboro, NC

Modified by AnneLFG at Tue, Aug 13, 2019, 14:35:51

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"Lamp wound glass beads"
Re: Pompeii Beads, Amulets and Ornaments Excavated -- AnneLFG Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Beadman Post Reply
08/14/2019, 15:57:25

Lampworking is a technique that was developed at Venice in the mid-to-late 15th C. Any "lamp work beads from antiquity" are most-likely trade bead intrusions—as has happened fairly often.

But in this instance, here's my reply, posted at FaceBook, to the notice of these Pompeian beads also seen there today:

This is such typical lurid phrasing, to draw attention. "Sorcerer" indeed (not). A collection of beads and ornaments—something that is a worldwide phenomenon, is now a "mysterious arsenal of charms." What is mysterious about this? JDA.

I can recognize and identify several beads in this "collection."



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Sorcerer?
Re: "Lamp wound glass beads" -- Beadman Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Rosanna Post Reply
08/14/2019, 17:12:09

Well at least you are allowing for the possibility that a man was the bead and ornament collector, rather than assuming they had to belong to a woman!

I further postulate (with zero evidence, I must admit) that the beads belonged to a previous incarnation of one of our modern day male bead experts, and that he was saving them for future study. Which is exactly what has happened, although a bit later than planned!



Modified by Rosanna at Wed, Aug 14, 2019, 17:15:40

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No reference to gender from me.
Re: Sorcerer? -- Rosanna Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Beadman Post Reply
08/14/2019, 23:28:16



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I didn’t see any mention of “sorcerer” in the article
Re: No reference to gender from me. -- Beadman Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Rosanna Post Reply
08/15/2019, 14:34:27

So I assumed you used that word to summarize the writer’s suppositions about why the beads were collected. Probably I missed something. Anyway, it struck me that you would use sorcerer rather than sorceress. I was also attempting a comment concerning the bias that people display when they assume beads and ornaments were (and are) for women exclusively.
The bead community is both broad and deep, something I greatly appreciate!



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Re: “Sorcerer”
Re: I didn’t see any mention of “sorcerer” in the article -- Rosanna Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Beadman Post Reply
08/15/2019, 15:08:57

As mentioned in my post here, I quoted from my reply at FaceBook, earlier the same day.

My response at FB was about the same cache of beads, but was based on a BBC story, for which there is a link.

Attached here is a screenshot of the BBC story.

I am probably the most-unbiased male person you will ever meet, in terms of gender identities and presumptions about bead use(s). After all, I have been breaking down these stereotypes since 1967.

JDA.

bbc_screenshot_sorcerer_aug19.jpg (108.0 KB)  


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Jamey, please...
Re: Re: “Sorcerer” -- Beadman Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: nishedha Post Reply
08/16/2019, 01:03:08

...wouldn't you show us again that unforgettable picture of yourself wearing a dark purple tunic, long frisé hair and BEADS, back in those unforgettable flower-power days?



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1974 Photo
Re: Jamey, please... -- nishedha Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Beadman Post Reply
08/16/2019, 13:31:35

This was taken on the lower deck of my home in San Francisco in about 1974. Jamey

jamey_74_paisley_shirt.jpg (36.9 KB)  


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Re: 1974 Photo ( great photo Jamey )
Re: 1974 Photo -- Beadman Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: metateman Post Reply
08/16/2019, 17:03:09

Hello all

Jamey great photo.



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I love that picture.
Re: 1974 Photo -- Beadman Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Joyce Post Reply
08/17/2019, 07:29:45



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Re: Sorcerer?
Re: Sorcerer? -- Rosanna Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: petrusgeorgius Post Reply
08/15/2019, 02:42:25

the journalists , it seems , take the easy way .

why a woman ? maybe a man , collector - maybe a woman , trading beads and charms - bringing the box at home , to protect from thieves or other problems - maybe somebody who had a little child who picked evrything he could catch - one day we will know



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Obviously I am referring to a melting and winding technique
Re: "Lamp wound glass beads" -- Beadman Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: AnneLFG Post Reply
08/17/2019, 00:32:56

Obviously I am referring to a glass melting and winding technique and you are probably precisely right, as I have no idea how they melted the glass- if it be by a "lamp" or however. But I am fairly sure it "looks" lamp wound as opposed to a variety of other things such as molded.

This article and the following mutations, as in the BBC News and others I think suffer from Poor Translation and also a need for sensationalism in a competitive news environment

What was interesting I thought was the obvious Trade mixture, which is not surprising, but there are a lot of interesting trinkets stashed in that wooden box.

Bead lover, collector since Age 15, semi-retired had wholesale/retail bead, folk art, tribal art store Lost and Found Gallery for 25 yrs. in DT Greensboro, NC

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Re: "..., melting and winding...."
Re: Obviously I am referring to a melting and winding technique -- AnneLFG Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Beadman Post Reply
08/17/2019, 14:49:52

Dear Anne,

My intent was not scold you, but rather to help you understand glass technology and it's terms better. And to get it that by your saying an ancient bead was "lamp worked" that this would be an anachronism (to say nothing of being an impossibility). Furnace-wound beads and lamp-wound beads have certain characteristics in-common. But they also have distinctions that make it possible to tell them apart. And the correct use of a term or name makes your thoughts more clear and in-keeping with actual history.

And yes—popular "news reports" frequently rely on sensationalism to get attention. But by doing that they often get it wrong, and say silly stuff.

Be well. Jamey



Modified by Beadman at Sat, Aug 17, 2019, 19:26:43

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Re: Re: "..., melting and winding...."
Re: Re: "..., melting and winding...." -- Beadman Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: AnneLFG Post Reply
08/19/2019, 11:46:41

Thank you it only would have been more helpful to know what the term actually was in your first comment.

Bead lover, collector since Age 15, semi-retired had wholesale/retail bead, folk art, tribal art store Lost and Found Gallery for 25 yrs. in DT Greensboro, NC

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To Clarify for Anyone Interested Re Flameworked/Wound Glass Beads VS Lampwound Glass Beads ETC
Re: Re: "..., melting and winding...." -- Beadman Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: AnneLFG Post Reply
08/21/2019, 00:05:16

Found this, which may help others, including myself, get a better idea of what Jamie was saying about "Lampworked" glass being associated more precisely with a Venetian glass bead making technique....and why other terms like "flame worked beads" or "wound glass beads" are more accurate for more Ancient beads that have been "melted by the flame" and wound around something resembling a mandrel, wire or core of some type.

As I understand it, once glass was melted in a hot enough heat source like inside a "Hot Volcano", Beehive type oven, or the like, the product could be manipulated at a top hot vent or opening that concentrated the temperature. Hot glass could be extracted from bottom openings and worked at the vent. Cooled glass chunks or pulled tubes of various colors could be reheated at the top vent, and beads in process could be surface decorated with additional colors there. Of course this simplistic explanation leaves something to be desired, but i hope it is accurate enough.

I am only speaking about Wound glass beads in particular. There are many other techniques and also combinations of techniques. It is fascinating and I'll be trying to learn more.

from "Art Glass Lampwork History" [Article from A Global Overview of Flameworked Glass Art" by Jennifer Frehling Zamboli and Robert Mickelson- with permission].:

http://www.theglassmuseum.com/lampwork.html

Bead lover, collector since Age 15, semi-retired had wholesale/retail bead, folk art, tribal art store Lost and Found Gallery for 25 yrs. in DT Greensboro, NC

Modified by AnneLFG at Wed, Aug 21, 2019, 00:19:31

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Definitions
Re: To Clarify for Anyone Interested Re Flameworked/Wound Glass Beads VS Lampwound Glass Beads ETC -- AnneLFG Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: floorkasp Post Reply
08/21/2019, 04:18:07

It does get tricky indeed, when it comes to defining what distinguishes one type of wound glass bead from the next.
At the moment, I am working on a book about lampworked beads, and will look at the early methods of wound beads, and the newer method of lampworking.

The method of making wound glass beads with the 'Hot Vulcano' is one example of a method of making wound glass beads that has some similarities to lampwork beads. However, there are also still differences.

Even though the definitions of lampworking vary, there are a few characteristics to lampworking. The most important one is, like Jamey also said, the use of a single pointed flame as a heat source. Others are the use of pre-fabricated glass, either as chunks or rods, that are heated in the flame. This method allows the maker to be up close to the actual making of the bead.
The original method for lampworking was the use of an oil lamp with a blow tube through which the maker would blow to create a hotter and more pointed flame. Later versions include the use of bellows, double bellows, and much later: oxygen. The fuel source has also changed from a variety of oils/fats to different types of gas.
From what I have mostly seen, flameworking is a term for the same method as lampworking. However, the term flameworking was (and is) more commonly used for work related to the making of scientific glass instruments, working with hollow glass tubing and specifically working with borosilicate glass. I do not see it used much as an alternative for wound glass predating lampwork.

The main difference with the 'Hot Vulcano' and lampwork is how pointed the flame is. There have been quite a few interesting experiments in getting a more pointed flame in a variety of different shaped furnaces, and even in an open flame. Also, there are a few examples dating back to Roman times where glass objects show signs of the use of a very small pointed flame, which can only be achieved by lampworking. So there is some 'crossover' between one technique and the other. However, the general rule is if a bead predates 1600 CE (or thereabouts) it is not a lampworked bead.

And to make it more complicated: not all lampwork beads are wound beads. For example small hollow blown beads, made from a tube of glass, are often lampwork beads, but are not wound.



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I pretty much agree. JDA.
Re: Definitions -- floorkasp Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Beadman Post Reply
08/21/2019, 05:27:13



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Re: Definitions
Re: Definitions -- floorkasp Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: AnneLFG Post Reply
08/22/2019, 03:30:33

I love that you were able to further clarify these distinctions. Thanks so much. And best of luck on your Publication!

Those of us not coming from a truly Technical perspective may easily fall into loose and inaccurate descriptions of beads as I did: "Lampworked", just imagining some melted glass wound around a "stick". Much more to it, of course.

Thanks!

Bead lover, collector since Age 15, semi-retired had wholesale/retail bead, folk art, tribal art store Lost and Found Gallery for 25 yrs. in DT Greensboro, NC

Modified by AnneLFG at Thu, Aug 22, 2019, 03:34:31

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Re: Names and Technical Information - 2010
Re: Re: Definitions -- AnneLFG Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Beadman Post Reply
08/22/2019, 04:48:19

This is my reply to a longish dialogue about naming issues, and creating a usable lexicon of bead names, types, and classifications. JDA.

bcn_bead_names_etc_10.jpg (87.9 KB)  


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Re: Re: "..., melting and winding...."
Re: Re: "..., melting and winding...." -- Beadman Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Beadman Post Reply
08/21/2019, 06:27:23

The similarities, but more importantly the differences between furnace-wound beads and lampworked wound beads was first presented by Peter Francis in 1982, in his paper for The Glass Trade Bead Conference (Rochester, NY, published in 1983). However I had a discussion with him about this topic in 1979 or 1980. It was Peter who helped my make these distinctions.

Lampwork beads are derived from the process of melting preformed canes at a "lamp." Nowadays, a torch.

In contradistinction, in the making of furnace-wound beads, the worker removes a small quantity of hot melted glass from a crucible, and attenuates it into a trail—and thereupon makes a wound bead. So there is "winding," but not "heating" as is required in lampworking. The glass is already hot and liquid.

Jamey



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From 2006
Re: Re: Re: "..., melting and winding...." -- Beadman Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Beadman Post Reply
08/21/2019, 06:35:19

This was tortuous, but I finally came to understand that the bead shown was a tabular Venetian bead.

http://beadcollector.net/cgi-bin/anyboard.cgi?fvp=/openforum/&cmd=iYz&aK=38881&iZz=38881&gV=0&kQz=&aO=1&iWz=0


Related link: http://beadcollector.net/cgi-bin/anyboard.cgi?fvp=/openforum/&cmd=iYz&aK=38881&iZz=38881&gV=0&kQz=&aO=1&iWz=0

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