Post Message Search Overview RegisterLoginAdmin
Coconut shell beads ?
Post Reply Edit View All Forum
Posted by: Karlis Post Reply
08/06/2019, 12:01:58

A museum curator has sent me this image for ID. At first I thought these were vinyl disk beads but she suggested coconut shell. It doesn't look like that to me but they could be dyed black. They are from West Africa. Any thoughts?

Coconut_sml.jpg (218.1 KB)  


Copyright 2024
All rights reserved by Bead Collector Network and its users
Re: Coconut shell beads ? better image
Re: Coconut shell beads ? -- Karlis Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Karlis Post Reply
08/06/2019, 12:12:40

The first image was too dark. I lightened it and the brown color became apparent. So does look like coconut shell.

Coconut_light_xx.jpg (145.9 KB)  


Copyright 2024
All rights reserved by Bead Collector Network and its users
Palm Nut Beads.
Re: Re: Coconut shell beads ? better image -- Karlis Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Beadman Post Reply
08/06/2019, 13:26:41

I think "coconut" is too specific.

Brown-to-black hishi-like beads, made from palm nuts, have been staple products from West African since the '70s. JDA.



Copyright 2024
All rights reserved by Bead Collector Network and its users
Re: Coconut Beads
Re: Palm Nut Beads. -- Beadman Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Beadman Post Reply
08/08/2019, 00:29:03

I have some actual coconut beads, and also coconuts. The material is thicker, (than the beads being discussed) and more brown and spotty. Unfortunately, I don't think I have photographed them. (Or, it was a long time ago.) When I come across them, I'll come back.



Modified by Beadman at Thu, Aug 08, 2019, 00:30:02

Copyright 2024
All rights reserved by Bead Collector Network and its users
Yes, coconut shell
Re: Re: Coconut shell beads ? better image -- Karlis Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Rosanna Post Reply
08/06/2019, 14:01:12

The old ones have been smoothed over nicely with use & age. They are often found on strands mixed with Celluloid disk beads - likely all of these are from pre-WWII.

After WWII both of these materials were replaced with vinyl.



Copyright 2024
All rights reserved by Bead Collector Network and its users
Hmmm....
Re: Yes, coconut shell -- Rosanna Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Beadman Post Reply
08/06/2019, 17:53:06

I'm am surprised by your confidence that what you say is accurate.

As near as I can tell, both old and recent palm-nut beads have been readily available since the '70s—though it's true I have not had the need to source any in recent years, because I have plenty.

Offhand, I don't recall ever seeing any African strands that combine palm-nut beads with "Celluloid" beads. In any event, I would not think of it as a common presentation. I wonder whether this is your perspective because you have only collected African beads for about ten years. Whereas my memories go back to the first wave of African collecting. That might account for different perspectives.

I'm not sure what to say about 'Celluloid being replaced by vinyl.' I am not confident the older disk beads (that are actually sequins) were made from Celluloid. I suppose cellulose-acetate might be a possibility. But, in fact, I'm uncertain how I or anyone would go about actually dating these different versions/editions of beads. JDA.



Copyright 2024
All rights reserved by Bead Collector Network and its users
I have some info and examples
Re: Hmmm.... -- Beadman Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Rosanna Post Reply
08/06/2019, 21:23:10

Hi Jamey,
I'm currently doing research on the thin disk beads that today are commonly called "vulcanite" but have only been observed (by me) in the Celluloid and vinyl versions. My hypothesis is that the disks were originally made from vulcanized rubber sheet stock and the name stuck after Celluloid was commercialized.

In searching for evidence that these disks were originally made from real vulcanite (hard vulcanized rubber), I've purchased quite a number of the oldest, most distressed-looking strands of disks. The older ones are mainly Celluloid disks with some palm wood disks sprinkled in. Here is a close-up of one strand. The Celluloid disks can easily be identified by noting that they have a lot of chips - the beads have become quite brittle with age and will crack apart easily. To confirm this, I also use my sniff test after reaming the holes to detect the odor of camphor.

I saw quite a few bead sample cards at the Jablonec Museum archives with Celluloid disks like these, in solid colors and also striped ones. They date from the interwar period - no specific dates have been preserved. However, Celluloid was being made into beads starting in the late 1800s so some of the disks may be pre-WWI. Celluloid items of all kinds were made up until about the 1950s, when other, less flammable plastics replaced Celluloid.

Cellulose acetate (CA), as far as I've determined to date, was not used that much for beads. I've only found buttons made from CA so far, but that doesn't mean there aren't CA beads out there. If you have any that you suspect are CA, the reamer test will emit an odor of vinegar (acetic acid) rather than camphor.

Flexible PVC was in commercial production in 1931, but if I were to guess, the "vinyl" versions of thin disk beads were not available until after WWII. According to John Picard, the vinyl disk production was from Czech R. until the Chinese put them out of business sometime in the 1980s.

I'm actively working on documenting the history of these thin disks so if anyone has any info please let me know! Especially, if anyone has any of the older disk strands (most are black and red only) where the beads are chipped and broken - I'd like to buy them from you so I can look for disks that may be made from vulcanite rubber or even other materials. You can tell the Celluloid ones from vinyl - you can easily break the Celluloid ones in pieces but it's basically impossible to fracture the vinyl ones by hand - they will bend but not break apart.

RFCelluloidCoconutDisksAug2019.jpg (58.7 KB)  


Copyright 2024
All rights reserved by Bead Collector Network and its users
Hypothetical sequence of development
Re: I have some info and examples -- Rosanna Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Rosanna Post Reply
08/06/2019, 21:47:41

This is speculation on my part, based on the idea that the Europeans were noted for making beads for the Africans based on what the Africans already were using for their adornments:

The first disks were made by the Africans out of palm nut or other nut, shell, or wood. We know that disk beads made from ostrich shell were common, so thin disk beads were desirable.

I further speculate that the Europeans introduced dIsk beads from vulcanite sheet stock, then Celluloid, and finally from vinyl. I have documentation that the Celluloid beads were replaced as soon as possible due to the high flammability of the Celluloid disk, which caused severe burns to people and also fires aboard the merchant ships. So perhaps the vinyl versions were in play prior to WWII - needs more research.

I believe that some palm nut disks can be well over 100 years old. I imagine that they were saved and incorporated into updated strands when the Celluloid disks became available. Of course, it also appears that the palm nut disks are still being made. A lot of pure strands of palm or coconut disks appear to have little to no wear, in contrast to the very smooth edges of the old ones.



Modified by Rosanna at Wed, Aug 07, 2019, 04:27:46

Copyright 2024
All rights reserved by Bead Collector Network and its users
P.S. from M.J. Opper
Re: I have some info and examples -- Rosanna Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Rosanna Post Reply
08/06/2019, 21:52:38

There was a discussion thread in 2011 in which Marie-Jose Opper said that the Celluloid disk beads were made from 1900 - 1930. I am searching for documentation to confirm these and other dates.



Copyright 2024
All rights reserved by Bead Collector Network and its users


Forum     Back