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Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads 1930s vs 1970s vs 1990s
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Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/16/2017, 13:16:22

birdi asked for something demonstrating the difference between these beads from the 1930s and those manufactured following Liberation in 1949.

The first difference is the lines carved into the scrolls. Compare with the scrolls on the Qing vase from the Wikipedia article.

The second difference is the composition of the lacquer. Various sources indicate the raw lacquer sap is mixed with either wax or oil, plus the vermilion coloring powder. The beads from the 1930s frequently show severe deterioration, likely from heat? This is what made me wonder if the substance has a formula similar to sealing wax.

I've inspected the 1930s beads with a loupe, and if there are layers there, I cannot see them. [LATER: Correction. The beads in the bracelet with chain tassels do show layering. They also show spots of a brighter red wax, possibly used to repair carving slips?] Recall the mention of a sort of cinnabar putty being used in the years between WW1 and WW2 - putty usually being linseed oil and chalk, but perhaps a different oil/filler composition was used by the Chinese? One that melts under heat, or perhaps water?

[I replaced the deteriorated beads from the necklace and bracelet. The smaller bracelet bead is carved lacquer, the large fish bead is molded something.]

Attached is a Google Translate quote from a 2008 Chinese magazine article cited in the Wikipedia article, describing the trajectory of arts such as cinnabar carving (and cloisonne as well) from the 1950s until 2000. Basically, under the new Chinese Communist Party government, art students then in their teens and early 20s were assigned to learn traditional crafts such as cloisonne, lacquer carving, ivory carving, jade carving - they did not get to choose which. The goal was to sell fine crafts abroad to earn desperately needed foreign exchange - sell cloisonne, buy machines. When relations were re-established with the US in the 1970s, exports of these crafts boomed. By the 1980s, the pressures of mass production began to take its toll in the increasing adulteration, simplification, and more careless technique. During the 1990s, when other forms of export industries began to get traction, the traditional craft factories became backwaters and by 2000 were bankrupt and had to be reorganized. Hundreds of employees in each factor were laid off, only a core group of masters and technicians remained.

Following is a series of photos showing the decline of carved lacquer from what appear to be actual carved lacquer pieces from the 1970s to the silicone-molded waxy products of the 1990s onward.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carved_lacquer

Chinese_carved_cinnabar_lacquerware_(3).jpg (253.4 KB)  SAM_8083_(2).JPG (222.9 KB)  


Modified by beadiste at Sun, Jul 16, 2017, 15:46:03

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Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads 1970s
Re: Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads 1930s vs 1970s vs 1990s -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/16/2017, 13:19:46

The 3 large shou-pattern beads show two 1970s beads on the left, strung with fancy knotting and enameled end caps (one I took apart). You can also see a tiny carving error in the one on the left, where the knife slipped and a line is shortened.

Oddly, I'm uncertain whether the lines displayed on the edges of the carving in the first bead are layers of lacquer, or artifacts of a toothed carving tool. The layers on the second bead are apparent; it also seems to be better carved and with a shiny lacquer surface instead of the dry surface of the first bead. What seems to be a difference in the type of lacquer applied - shiny vs dry - also shows up in the necklace beads in the next photos.

The beads on the right are molded waxy something - you can see where the mold line around the edge has been smoothed away.

The guri carved lacquer bead shows the multiple alternating layers of red and black.

SAM_8078_(2).JPG (242.9 KB)  SAM_8082_(2).JPG (176.3 KB)  


Modified by beadiste at Sun, Jul 16, 2017, 14:16:36

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Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads 70s-80s?
Re: Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads 1930s vs 1970s vs 1990s -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/16/2017, 13:27:39

Various necklaces, the center one with the cloisonne beads showing nicer layered lacquer and two beads (the brighter red pair just left of center) that are more similar to the other beads pictured.

It's difficult to discern the layers on these brighter, drier-looking beads - almost as if the lacquer is some sort of thick chalky dip.

The beads in the lower center strand (the one with the silver filigree bead) also show an odd characteristic - they are mostly only shiny around their middles, as if a layer of wax? were applied and buffed. It's possible to see the difference between the final thin wax? layer and where it overlaps a bit on the end caps. The final layer seems tough enough - couldn't scrape it with my fingernail - but I didn't go poking any needles into it.

The oval beads on the lower strand are painted in the manner of ancient red and black lacquer - whether with paint or with actual lacquer, I don't know. The red figures seem to be applied with a stamp, not a brush. The cores are wood.

SAM_8077_(2).JPG (193.9 KB)  


Modified by beadiste at Mon, Jul 17, 2017, 13:21:09

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Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads with Cloisonne
Re: Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads 1930s vs 1970s vs 1990s -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/16/2017, 13:30:57

Unlike the beads in prior pictures, which are very light weight and appear to have wooden cores, the cloisonne beads are comparatively heavy thanks to their brass or copper cores.

The lacquer around the cloisonne again appears to be that dry paste similar to the carved beads, although the patterns do seem to be somewhat carved rather than stamped.

SAM_8080_(2).JPG (129.5 KB)  


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Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads - NOT!
Re: Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads 1930s vs 1970s vs 1990s -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/16/2017, 13:42:37

Two pictures showing what appears to be a sort of grainy molded wax or plastic, and an cloisonne elephant with what feels like some sort of polymer clay or something. Underneath the tough outer layer is what behaves exactly like red wax - I can easily poke a needle into it, them smooth away the hole and other marks with my fingernail.

No idea what this stuff is, but it's not lacquer.

SAM_8081_(2).JPG (127.8 KB)  SAM_8085_(2).JPG (172.5 KB)  


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Re: Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads - NOT!
Re: Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads - NOT! -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/16/2017, 13:44:33

A close-up of one of the waxy areas on the elephant.

All these pictures are available in bigger megabyte versions, so if anyone wants to zoom in on details, send me your email address and I'll wing you the bigger files.

SAM_8085_(4).JPG (162.7 KB)  


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Re: Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads
Re: Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads 1930s vs 1970s vs 1990s -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/16/2017, 13:52:50

ChineseLacquerArticle.jpg (195.6 KB)  


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More examples showing deterioration of 1930s beads
Re: Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads 1930s vs 1970s vs 1990s -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/17/2017, 08:00:48

And the absence of layers of lacquer.

Cinnabar_LacquerBeads1930s.jpg (206.6 KB)  Cinnabar_LacquerBeads1930s2.jpg (157.9 KB)  


Modified by beadiste at Mon, Jul 17, 2017, 08:02:28

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A 1920s-30's "Miriam Haskell" Style Chinese Charm Necklace with Melted "Cinnabar"
Re: Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads 1930s vs 1970s vs 1990s -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/29/2017, 11:49:30

Continuing my perverse fascination with these necklaces, recently found another one on eBay, with two deteriorated "cinnabar" beads.

I removed the two charms missing their brass bob dangles and the icky cinnabar beads, and re-positioned the salvaged elements.

Then I took an exacto-knife to the smaller melted bead. The substance is so soft I can press a fingernail into it, and just being warmed in my hand was enough that I could feel the whole thing give under pressure.

The larger bead seems to show some traces of the original layered application of the goo, unless the lines are artifacts of a toothed carving tool. Note how the lower levels of the goo have melted, and seem to ooze like lava.

Anyone willing to take a guess as to what this stuff is, and whether the red color comes from rust or from vermilion?

Rosanna says a materials analysis starts at $75, and I can't really see paying that for what are, at bottom, junky old beads.

SAM_8087_(2).JPG (172.6 KB)  SAM_8088_(2).JPG (205.9 KB)  


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Re: A 1920s-30's "Miriam Haskell" Style Chinese Charm Necklace with Melted "Cinnabar"
Re: A 1920s-30's "Miriam Haskell" Style Chinese Charm Necklace with Melted "Cinnabar" -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/29/2017, 11:51:36

The original necklace, and the reconstructed version.

ChineseCharmNecklace.jpg (162.9 KB)  SAM_8086_(2).JPG (188.8 KB)  


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Cinnabar goo
Re: A 1920s-30's "Miriam Haskell" Style Chinese Charm Necklace with Melted "Cinnabar" -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Rosanna Post Reply
07/29/2017, 18:08:57

Chris,
You are right in that it doesn't make sense to have anyone analyze the goo. If it' a complex mixture the analysis would be very tedious, and far more than $75. While it would be interesting to know what went into the goo, I don't think its worth much effort.

Based on your research into this type of material - layered paints or lacquers of various compositions - I suspect one of the following scenarios:

1) the beads are fairly recent, and made from an inexpensive concoction, applied in layers, with some layers not cured properly (usually this is due to poor mixing of the ingredients)- so they are still soft.
2) the beads are older, and made from a mixture that includes a polymer that has partially "reverted" or depolymerized to its more liquid components. This was a problem with some early polyurethanes (maybe up to the 1980s).
3) some other degradation has happened due to moisture absorption, which will affect poorly cured materials as well as some older plastics like Celluloid.

Any idea how old these beauties are?



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Re: Cinnabar goo
Re: Cinnabar goo -- Rosanna Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/29/2017, 18:38:40

Rosanna -

Pretty sure they date to around the 1930s - give a decade either way. The line inscribed inside the scroll motif appears in early 20th century cinnabar, but never after WWII.

And it doesn't appear to be moisture that decomposes them so much as heat. And not much heat - body temperature alone seems enough to impart a shiny gloss.

Genuine urushi tree-sap lacquer has the curious feature that it requires a warm, humid environment for the sap to polymerize into a tough, resistant coating. I wonder if they added too much oil or wax to the sap, and it never cured properly? Oil or wax might account for the tendency of the stuff to melt under heat.

I've assembled a modest suite of photographs of auction offerings over the past few years that are making me wonder if these necklaces and bracelets were the products of one Chinese workshop. They all feature

-brass dangles,
-stone nuggets and small round beads either plain or carved with a shou character of turquoise, carnelian agate, jade, some sort of lapis or dyed jasper,
-splashy folk-art style cloisonne beads in an immediately recognizable design
-Chinese filigree work
-an odd assortment of what appear to be European? findings and chain, none of which resemble those connected with the Miriam Haskell atelier.

So I wonder, did these pre-date the Haskell designs and inspire them, or vice versa?



Modified by beadiste at Sat, Jul 29, 2017, 18:56:46

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Some other examples
Re: Re: Cinnabar goo -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/29/2017, 18:50:45

I think Florence owns this necklace.

One characteristic of these pieces is that the stones are real - the coral and turquoise and amethyst and carnelian etc are all stones, not plastic.

But the "cinnabar" seems to be that shiny, meltable stuff.

2_IMG_0017.JPG (57.8 KB)  IMG_0011_(1).JPG (53.2 KB)  


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Wax under lacquer?
Re: Cinnabar goo -- Rosanna Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/30/2017, 23:53:00

Rosanna -

The Japanese videos show a sequence of 57 (!) videos of the process for making a rice bowl, demonstrating how the thin wood base of the bowl is covered with a succession of base coats of lacquer, fine linen cloth attached with a mix of lacquer & rice glue, then a succession of layers of lacquer mixed with powdery sawdust, fine clay, with sanding between layers, until the final black and red layers are applied.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEaNCHxcN2Q

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TPmTYdh8oI

So I wonder if the Chinese workshop that made these beads, presumably under stressful economic conditions the times being what they were, might have resorted to some economical sort of wax+ sawdust mixture for the base layer covering the wooden bead, with a few layers of actual red lacquer atop that? Could that account for the way the material seems to melt from the inside out? They overdid the wax?



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Sure, it's possible
Re: Wax under lacquer? -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Rosanna Post Reply
07/31/2017, 07:26:24

I think the inner layers must be a different material as you speculate, but I think the material has degraded over the last 70 years rather than being gooey to start with. But we're drifting off into total speculation now...



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Another Chinese charm necklace, $785 asking price on eBay
Re: A 1920s-30's "Miriam Haskell" Style Chinese Charm Necklace with Melted "Cinnabar" -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/30/2017, 19:37:50

With yet another example of that deteriorated cinnabar.

Plus the curious addition of two Venetian millefiori on the ends.

Item 232429798509

It's been listed for a few months now, I think. If it sells, will immediately list my two $35 specimens....

1_CharmNecklaceGilded2_(432x324).jpg (124.2 KB)  


Modified by beadiste at Sun, Jul 30, 2017, 20:54:32

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You may be interested in knowing about a Japanese Phd program in Urushi Art…scroll down.
Re: Chinese Carved Cinnabar Lacquer Beads 1930s vs 1970s vs 1990s -- beadiste Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: Frederick II Post Reply
07/29/2017, 15:06:46

When first established, the Tokyo University of the Arts was known as the Tokyo Art School. Two courses – the Kyuushitsu Course and the Makie Course – were the precursors of what would later become consolidated into the Urushi-Art(Japanese Lacquer) Course.

http://www.geidai.ac.jp/english/art/crafts



Modified by Frederick II at Sat, Jul 29, 2017, 15:12:17

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Many YouTube videos, such as these [fushimi urushi kobo - fushimiurushikobo]
Re: You may be interested in knowing about a Japanese Phd program in Urushi Art…scroll down. -- Frederick II Post Reply Edit Forum Where am I?
Posted by: beadiste Post Reply
07/29/2017, 19:29:36

Mixing actual mercury vermilion into lacquer:
(notice how it results in a paste that must be kneaded, then liquid lacquer is added in two more steps until a sort of thick syrup is achieved)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09fWbdlCrUs

Here the urushi is mixed with a rice flour pudding:

(And I love how he uses his little bamboo scraper to clean his bowls and spatula and not waste a drop)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IE7ir4hvmY

The first few minutes are of interest the way it shows how the lacquer sap is mixed with colorant and - something liquid? What?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ao_geAaxjgs

There seem to be about 50-60 videos in this series. I recommend using the scroll button liberally, lest you find yourself gazing at a screen for ten minutes watching someone stir something. Skip to the action parts. [Unless, of course, you're baked and watching paint dry is just a fine way to chill as you work your way through a bag of cheetos]



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